I’m just curious what people like Marco Rubio and Mark Zuckerberg, who are passively supportive of the installation of authoritarianism, would have learned at school about that period in Germany.
I’m asking this as that question and not as a leading question into a discussion on today’s politics.
What is the level of awareness the average American person in their 40s and 50s on how the Third Reich started?
One thing to keep in mind with a lot of responses is often when someone says “we didn’t learn about x in high school”, what they should be saying is “I didn’t learn about x in high school”. I’ve certainly heard former classmates claiming not to have learned something even though they were sitting next to me when I learned it.
When i was a preteen, we learned about WW2, mainly from a US perspective, and had a fairly large focus on the holocaust, including a visit to a holocaust museum.
As a teen, I had a class on specifically European history. In there, we learned about lot more about the rise of the nazis (though not much on Italian fascists).
Here’s the tl;dr on what I remember learning about then:
WWI ended with the treaty of Versailles which was not a realistic, sustainable peace. We learned about the economic trouble like hyperinflation. We learned about the beer hall putsch, and that it was effectively unpunished. We learned that Hitler then sought power through legal means by allying with a broad range of groups unhappy with the current government. As he rose to power, various elements were purged from the government. Concurrently, political violence from the stormtroopers suppressed minorities and other enemies from organizing against them. This culminated in Hitler being elected chancellor, and then the enabling act gave him ultimate power. In the night of the long knives, all the allied elements in the party were purged. After that was kristallnacht, the remilitarization of the rhineland, annexation of Austria and the sudetenland, and then finally the invasion of Poland.
I’m in the demographic you’re looking for. It went something like this:
- End of WWI with the Treaty of Versailles
- Massive war repayment debts placed on Weimar Republic
- Beer Hall Putsch
- The Weimar Republic falling because of disenfranchised German citizens
- Nazi party rising in power in the Reichstag
- Brown shirts (SA)
- Burning of the Reichstag
- Hitler seizing power
- Night of the Long Knives
- The west ignoring military limits on German military expansion (aircraft, Panzer 1)
- Annexation of Austria
- Talk of leibenstrom
etc
Thats from memory. Apologies for butchering any spelling or some of those events out of order.
So, yes, lots and LOTS of things in the USA government right now are ringing alarm bells like crazy. Executive orders just this week of military support for local police “to root out immigrants” sound close to creation of the Brownshirts (SA). The villainization of immigrants sound disgustingly close to the targeting of various minority groups that Hitler targeted (Roma, Jews, gays, Poles).
We learned about Anne Frank and read Night in middle school. In high school we had separate classes for US, world, and European history. We covered the beer hall putsch, kristalnacht, Reichstag fire, that Hitler was given emergency powers, etc. WWI reparations and hyperinflation. Propaganda and Josef Goebbels “if you repeat a lie long enough, people will start to believe it”. Watched some of Triumph of the Will. We also had separate classes covering western philosophy which included Nitzche and how Nazis appropriated the will to power. I’m sure I’m forgetting a lot of the details. However I suspect this is more education than the average American receives.
I went to a school in the middle of nowhere Texas and learned only about half of what you did and it still was impressed upon us how terrible the nazis were. There’s no reason any American shouldn’t know that this is heading right back in that direction.
I received approximately the same education. Except without the last bit about philosophy. But I went to a decent school - I can’t speak for all Americans.
In the mid-70s, in middle school (8th grade), we were taught all about the holocaust-which I remember because of the pictures and movies. I don’t remember what we were taught about the war itself, I’m sure it was covered. I didn’t realize it then, but many of my teachers grew up during, or were adults during WWII, simply based on how old they were. My English teacher that year was 70+, and he told combat stories in class.
School teaching of history has changed a lot since I was in K-12 … but at that time, I never had a history class that got so far as WW1. Yep. We spent months on the history of Europe from the Holy Roman Empire up to (barely) von Bismarck. That was it.
I suspect that was because teachers were staying away from any history that might be known to anyone who was actually alive. My daughter, on the other hand, had a teacher who spent months on the Vietnam War. I was glad to hear that.
OTOH, when TV was black and white, there was a whole series on WW2 created by the US army called The Big Picture, broadcast on hundreds of stations. Each of over 800 half-hour episodes were available to any TV station that would air them. So there was a time when ADULTS -could- learn that stuff … and no doubt many of those who lived through that era were curious what their relatives and friends died for.
I’m fairly sure that a lot of today’s elected politicians would have paid no attention to that stuff. Many of them move in a different mental culture than people who’ve lost relatives to the whims of dictators. And of course they’re sure they’re smarter than people were back then. Like the Prime Example.
Obligatory butt-in from a European: I just wanted to provide a baseline for comparison.
Here in scandinavialand we watched The Wave (1981) in school to educate us on how easily a population can be convinced to support fascism.
This? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D55LkspO5ZU
We were shown this, but it’s not specifically about the war and more about racism:
Jane Elliott “Blue Eyes - Brown Eyes” Experiment Anti-Racism
Aside from the goriest details, I’ve known the gist of WW2 since middle school. Some things may have changed since then, but the people who are making the decisions aren’t far from my age.
That being said, all states have different education standards. If the Mississippi board of education decides there was no Holocaust, they aren’t going to teach it there.
The other variable is how much they cared. I know plenty of Americans that couldn’t tell you the history of anything, and I also know some people who’ve made a career out of American History.
There was no national shortage of knowledge available, some people just don’t care.
Very familiar but much more from university than from high school.
It was clearly taught in World History that nazis were far-right fascist authoritarians, which branched off from Mussolini far-right fascists. They were hate filled christians and catholics that put their fictional race above all others as a reason for genocide, theft, power, and control. With their god at their side, they aimed to take over the world, and subjugate or exterminate all others they found inadequate based on religious or non-scientific reasons.
That’s what our leaders learned as children/teens, too. But the same thing that was wrong with the nazis is wrong with them. Hate, power, money, in combination with addiction to hard drugs deletes all empathy. There aren’t enough checks against power hungry maniacs with money, power, or threats attempting to control everything.
We were also taught that people would violently rise up against a tyrannical government. In the American Government part of American History class. 2nd Amendment. Even in America. Especially in America. See movie: “Red Dawn” (1984) for 80’s vibe check about military occupation of America. There we also learned that the Civil War wasn’t entirely settled, with the North ‘taking it easy’ on the South and not forcing immediate slavery, and civil reform. Which results today in remaining pro-slavery, and ultra-conservative southern remnants of the confederate states of traitors. And their eternal quest to destroy the American federal government in any and every way possible.
Honestly most of my knowledge of US history and WW1/2 really came from me just watching the History channel when it actually showed quality historical documentaries and recreations.
Otherwise in Illinois we would go over world war II I think several semesters in high school and we watched footage of concentration camp liberations that we didn’t get into the details of what happened to German society after the Nuremberg trials and during reconstruction. Probably would have touched on that in a college course but I swayed more towards Asian studies
In Texas, we spent a semester (half the school year) learning Texas history, and the other half the year learning World History. This was during the start of “No Child Left Behind”, so it was basically “memorize the answers to the test”, instead of “actually learn the material”…