Meloni heads Italy’s most rightwing government since the second world war. Italy’s criminal code punishes with a fine ranging from €1,000 to €5,000 anyone who “publicly defames the republic”, which includes the government, parliament, the courts and the army.
As Porco Rosso said: “I’d rather be a pig than a fascist”. Be like Porco Rosso…
Porko Rosso
how to tell if youre in a facist state:
the person accusing the facist goes to jaildeleted by creator
Oh, Lemmy has fascists now.
The left wing was cutting public services, right. Famous left wing policy. I think you’re thinking of liberals.
It’s astounding these people still don’t realize how obvious their tells are. Blaming migrants? Almost certainly an insensible right winger.
One of the main ‘issues’ with decentralised social media is that it allows the fringes of the political spectrum to have a platform. We’ll have to find a way to get along.
I’m not sure I want to “get along” with fascists.
I share your general sentiment, I phrased the last part wrong - just trying to be civil in my post. Defederation with fascist instances would be the best shout.
You don’t get along with nazis you exterminate them like you would any parasite.
One of the main advantages of the federated medium is that providers can block the sources of gaslighting and propaganda and that users can move onto the ones that do.
deleted by creator
No you’re just a fascist agreeing with a fascist government. Might as well call yourself what you are.
Let me guess, whoever disagrees with your subjective experience is also a fascist am I rite
Except that the scales aren’t the same and that it favors those who have the power and money to persecute people who don’t through the legal system. Like, for example, prosecuting the someone randomly offending without any proof such as yourself.
deleted by creator
Courts are usually the last vestiges of authoritarian power in democracies, having to rely on the authority of life-long (and politically) appointed supreme court judges after all recourses have been tried and done (which for you may not be many if you don’t have a wealth of cash), and they are at their worst when tied to money, power, and lack of public transparency. Most countries don’t even have jury systems in their courts and you can’t represent yourself within it. The predominance of mafias in Italy and their spread internationally is more than a hint of how ineffective and biased they can be.
deleted by creator
if you think everyone should be able to offend anyone without effects, be it, i don’t agree
Sad that you don’t live by your own words, but unsurprising. And it was just 5 comments that had to be consistent with each other, too.
the left wings after years of cutting public services to bend to corporativism and ECB, leaving the country in the hands of all sort of migrants without doing anything for security, finally got what they deserve
deleted by creator
I’m sure Placebo, a British band, doesn’t give a single dry fuck what this stupid Italian fascist wants to investigate.
Someone is about to learn what “Streisand Effect” means.
They were in Italy at the time so I suppose they could have caused issues if they went full full fascist.
Ah, yes, nothing like forbidding people from calling out fascism to prove your government isn’t fascist.
Literal actual fascists behaving like fascists, surprise surprise.
Yeah this was my thought reading this, too.
Who woulda thunk that when you give the fascists power, they don’t stop being fascists! #surprisedpikachu
Didn’t the world fight a world war to stop this kind of government from taking full control over a people?
Nah, just the one. And it was because he was killing hordes of people, not controlling them.
Um Mussolini’s Fascist Italy was very much in the war
Wait, which mussolini? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alessandra_Mussolini
TIL about Italy’s shunning of their past in contrast to the “collective guilt” felt by Germans after WWII
Have you ever heard of Mafia. Bc if you come to this country they will mostly collectively lie and tell you" Hun? Naaaa that’s gone". You live here for a while and you like, oh ok, we just pretending it’s gone nice.
The fact that the Italian military & it’s leaders were spared from the Nuremberg Trials made this all the easier.
Sometimes it feels that Italy consists entirely of pasta, fascism and 🤌.
Proving them right, I see
Person: “You’re a fascist”
Government: “That’s wrong; we’re gonna use the power of the state to investigate and punish you for something you said”
Person: “Oh well I stand corrected. Totally not fascist at all…”
The USSR would also persecute people for criticizing the Soviet state or its leaders, but they weren’t fascist. Authoritarianism is something people on the left and right both get up to.
I’d argue the USSR was fascist the same way the DPRK is fascist. You aren’t necessarily left-wing just because you say you are.
deleted by creator
deleted by creator
Oh, Mellonhead is definitely a fascist, I’m just pointing out that you get the same kinda of oppression at the other end of the lef-right spectrum, too.
There’s plenty of oppression and violence smack dab in the center of the left right spectrum too. I’m not sure why horseshoe theory is so keen to equate Stalin, Mao, etc. with the violence of Hitler, Pinochet, etc. while ignoring the genocides of the Dutch East India Co. (and competitors), imperialism, the slave trade, settler colonialism, etc.
Absolutely! This is why, even though the political compass is a memey oversimplification at this point, it does get a the inadequacy of a single dimension view of political ideology. The authoritarian mindset is a human trait, and while some ideologies seem more prone to attracting people with that particular trait, by no means does it only occur in those cases.
Some people just want to rule over others.
If left-wing authoritarianism isn’t an oxymoron, then what the heck does left-wing mean?
I agree that authoritarianism does not equal fascism, but the only meaningful definition of left-right politics (in my opinion) is a measure of belief in and adherence to social hierarchies. And the USSR was definitely heavily into hierarchy.
Why would it be an oxymoron? There is nothing on the political chart or inherent to it to forbid the left wing to be authoritarian.
This is my thinking, let me know if you see any issues with my interpretation:
First line of Wikipedia Left-wing politics: Left-wing politics describes the range of political ideologies that support and seek to achieve social equality and egalitarianism, often in opposition to social hierarchy as a whole.
First list of Wikiepdia Authoritarianism: Authoritarianism is a political system characterized by the rejection of political plurality, the use of strong central power to preserve the political status quo, and reductions in the rule of law, separation of powers, and democratic voting.
By these definitions, Left-wing politics should want to evenly distribute power democratically, whereas authoritarianism wants to centralise power in a single entity such as a the military or a dictator.
The perpetual dictatorship of the proletariat in Marxist-Leninism is functionally indifferent from the dictatorship of the bourgeoisie. The authoritarian leadership just becomes the new bourgeoisie.
All good with the definitions, please share them as much as you want.
My claim is extremely simple, nothing is gonna stop you as a left wing representative to reach those objectives through authoritarian means.
I don’t see how is that hard to understand unless you claim some kind of special position for either side.
In which case, this is not a conversation I’m interested in.
Yeah, that’s where the left-right concept kinda breaks down.
It feels wrong to say the USSR wasn’t left when you consider the many left policies they had and of course their origin.
I also agree with your idea of what left-wing should mean. I guess there’s no way to avoid complexity with topics like this.
Stalin was absolutely a fascist.
He really wasn’t, though.
All fascists are authoritarians, not all authoritarians are fascist.
deleted by creator
Read about Red Fascism in history…
deleted by creator
Thats the fascist paradox.
Call someone a fascist, if they want to oppress you because you lied, then you are right, so they can oppress you, but if they dont oppress you, then you are wrong and you are to be oppressed, but then you will be right.
Meloni, 46, heads Italy’s most rightwing government since the second world war. Italy’s criminal code punishes with a fine ranging from €1,000 to €5,000 (£858 to £4,290) anyone who “publicly defames the republic”, which includes the government, parliament, the courts and the army.
Wow. Ok then…I guess technically he did violate that law and so it shouldn’t matter how fucked up that law is with respect to an investigation being done about it, but can we still talk about how fucked up that law is in an EU country? Yeah I know Italy’s a little bit different and such, but goddamn.
W would have loved to have had something like this when the Dixie Chicks got out of line over Iraq (though his response quoted there seems oddly…reasonable? ehh, fuck W): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dixie_Chicks_controversy
deleted by creator
Why is fascism even defamation of they love fascism so much?
Fascists don’t like to admit that they’re fascists. Or at least they don’t like it to be publicly known.
deleted by creator
Fair enough.
They have it in a lot of other countries in Europe too. Its fucking disgusting and constantly abused by conservatives. You also see it being used against people who insult the church in certain countries.
So no freedom of speech?
“Free speech bro’s would kindly request that all free speech is fully aligned with the party policies… thank you”
You’re free to be super duper racist, sexist, ableist, pretty much any kind of discrimination you want. Isn’t that enough?
No, I want talking shit about governments without government punishment. Ya know, freedom of speech
Anytime Meloni gets upset about anything I just remind her to be like her grandpa and turn that frown upside down.
but he’s right, so what?
More countries really need an irony clause in their constitutions. When the irony gets to this level clearly there are insufficient checks and balances in place.
That move just makes Brian seem more reasonable.
Gotta love the dipshits in the replies pushing the whole “the left calls anyone who disagrees with them a fascist!!1!” while conveniently leaving out any and all context as to what they’re disagreeing about. ~Cherri
